"Your meaning is that you and the team have not enough time and resources to deal with most of the issues brought up by the players. Sweet….."
I should think that fairly obvious for a project of any size. The suggestions on the feedback tracker range from – to veer off into analogies – from "I want a pony" to "the saddle on it should be dark brown, two-thirds between caramel and mahogany but no shades of nutmeg". This is also the case for any project that you care to inspect, although you can only verify it for those with open case/feedback tracking systems.
Since suggestions will continue to come in at much the same rate, the best anyone can hope for is to do a reasonable job: keep a reasonable majority of the players reasonably happy. However, we'll also let users delve into their own niches when we let players create their own tools and macros. That should make many of you happy, as it will unleash the same resources that currently make suggestions to the problem of implementing some of those suggestions.
I have been reluctant to speak, as my "hackle's are raised at this stage in "the game".
however…push comes to shove at some point…
In my opinion, the fundamental problem with foldit is the lack of accurate information given by foldit's official representatives and their belief that we are incapable of establishing any personal state of being further than "overwhelmed" by presentation of information.
Admin has stated that he alone is quite capable of addressing the technical questions posed routinely in chat and elsewhere, but his quotable attitude is "why overwhelm them with the details" And, in keeping with the tradition that foldit's official staff have engendered here I would guess that this attitude is shared by the rest of the development team.
And subsequently to the informational darkness in which we must blindly stumble.
The problem is twofold.
First, it forces us to guess when guessing is unnecessary, wasting valuable time both directly for its player participants and for the folding process.
Second, it is patently arrogant and condescending and establishes a conflictual environment rather than a cooperative, educated (and educational) environment.
It would be easy enough to compile hundreds of examples to back my allegation up, simply by logging the content of the global chat for a day or so. And over the last six months? lol…your guess is as good as mine…the number seems staggering to me, and the loss of participants due to that lack of information is evidenced by the continued low participation numbers.
For a project who's claimant purpose is the investigation of intuition, the project's ignorance of the source of intuition leaves alot to be desired and it leaves me wondering whether they even comprehend the concept in the first place.
It needs to be in a permanent, public location (forum, blog, FAQ) , not dispensed in chat where only a few get to see it.
That should include any how-to tidbits like hidden/undocumented functions or hot-keys.
On the other topic here, it seems like an inordinate amount of discussion and possibly resources is being put toward catering to the whims, demands or esoteric suggestions of the handful of "superstar" players. I think the regular guy is being somewhat ignored, and we're left to struggle with basic issues around the client, like the "R' crash, OS compatibility, hotkeys that change, appear and disappear at some whim, and are lacking basic and intermediate guidance on how to use the more advanced tools that already exist, such as rebuild, tweak, and some new "register shift" tool. (I still have no idea what this is or how or when to use it.) A simple announcement on the front page that the tool exists is not enough. There should be a thorough instruction set on each and every tool, written by the people who developed it, not by those users who think they know how it works.
How about a starter task? If I have one sidechain in a sheet that is on what I think is the wrong side of the sheet, how do I get that single segment to rotate so the sidechain is pointing in the desired direction? Or for that matter, any single segment that has a sidechain pointing in the wrong direction? We can all waste endless hours experimenting with this stuff, but what about some clear instruction on this type of basic move?
guys, foldit is (as so it is still written on the website next to the logo) beta, that is still in major development, and making us users 'betatesters', right? And there has been some major advances already. (Maybe the developers themselves have difficulties keeping up with all the changes ;).
If they would need to document and explain every bit, function, science, etc, we would still not have a rebuild, tweak or whatever tool yet.
Like for the new shift tool, they make it and I think (but that's only my opinion) that it is fired on us so that we can test it and see if it works for us or not. And yes later when most tools will be tweaked or deleted or changed and the game is more in a stable (in development) phase, then more info and documentation will have to be handed out. That would be fair enough then, but I don't feel ignored, neglected or frustrated about lack of anything now..
In response to Brick's questions about advanced tools: We are definitely trying to make good tutorials for all the tools that have been put in the game. The intro puzzles fell behind during the summer when we introduced tweak and rebuild tools, but we're making them a big focus now and I think there's been improvement in that area. We're constantly monitoring progress on levels by players to determine where changes need to be made, and are open to feedback on them as well. We try to present the main purposes of each tool in the intro levels, but you guys (the players) usually come up with other ideas on how to use the tools to fold better, which we love to see.
Regarding the sidechain-flipping question: You can use a rebuild and use rubber bands to direct the sidechain in the opposite direction, or you could try running a tweak on just that segment (changing everything around it to loops), and rotate that way. Both will likely cause side effects on the surrounding areas, but that's just the nature of the beast that you can't flip one residue in place. Those would be the two main ideas I would try, but your fellow players may have developed more advanced or useful solutions.
Brick,
You're right.
I for one will no longer be submitting suggestions, only bugs.
And I owe you an apology for my reaction to your comments a while ago..you were right, and I was wrong. Plain and simple
My biggest problem in fold.it is that there doesn't seem to be a helluva lot of positive feedback.
And a helluva lot ofwhat comes across as whinging, whining, complaining and arguing in the forum.
My solution…
Thanks muchly for making something with which many people can find hours of challenging enjoyable time whether motivated solely by getting a highscore or for the betterment of science. One can feel a real sense of achievement, especially with the All Hands Challenge.
Keep up the good work.
AudioElf
I wholeheartedly agree with AudioElf!!!
Only been here since…ehm, november last year (time flies), but there have been many improvements (on a program I already enjoyed) in that short time.
I love working on these puzzles, I love about every person I meet in chat (…still thinking about what to think about aot, though, lol), and it has been a blast!
The only thing bothering me is the rather negative way people talk about the game itself, especially here in the forums. No wonder there's so little action going on in here. Not very inviting for new players either, in my opinion.
Anyway, I like it, and I'm looking forward to every new thing the developer team is going to throw our way. In the mean time it would be nice to see this forum get a bit more fun!
Nicky, i fully sign your Post - especially the last 2 sentences. I couldn't have said it better.
That sounds like a great idea. I totally forgot that forums can be fun. But yeah, I like the sound of that.
Hmmm, how do we start? :)
